11/20: Tea Partiers Turn On Each Other
Posted by Editor on November 20, 2009 · 14 Comments
After emerging out of nowhere over the summer as a seemingly potent and growing political force, the tea party movement has become embroiled in internal feuding over philosophy, strategy and money and is at risk of losing its momentum.
The grass-roots activists driving the movement have become increasingly divided on such core questions as whether to focus their efforts on shaping policy debates or elections, work on a local, regional, state or national level or closely align themselves with the Republican Party, POLITICO found in interviews with tea party organizers in Washington and across the country.
I have a feeling that when this forum moved from Intense Debate to whoever is not running it, it became very impersonal. On Intense Debate, you could look up the profile of the person posting. You could get a feeling of what they stood for. This new forum is not user friendly. I am constantly having to re-sign in and everything seems so PC.
I think the Tea Party is alive and well. This is not the only site people use. There are several sites that are more user friendly and that you can get to know the people posting.
Pontificating is one thing. Showing academic wit so also very impressive, but I feel that The Constitution is sufficient to represent our Republic. We just need to get back to it and cut away all of the other extraneous mess that politicians have tried to add to it.
I’m just saying.
The FIST of truth is about to fall upon the heads of those who think they know whats best for the people and force there will upon us,, by useing our laws and systems against us,, it soon will be retruned in kind,,912ers keep on swinging the bat of truth,, nothing more nothing less..
RWA: I suggest spell check and proof reading your posts. You have made the point that lack of education leads to ignorance. What bat of truth is being swung? The one that compares an elected president to the fascist dictator who systematically murdered millions of people? Do you know the difference between socialism, communism, and fascism? They are actually not the same thing. Educate yourself instead of repeating catchphrases you hear on television.
Thank you michaeljenson, you are very eloquent. You say things in a way that would lead me to believe that you are a politician. You deflect the issues to make it sound as if the people involved in this project are stupid children. Where have I heard that before? There is something to be said about upgrading the Constitution when there is a major issue that affects people’s freedom and the 13th amendment would be a good example. Lets not forget the 18th amendment and the 21st amendment. Prohibiting the use of alcohol and then repealing the prohibition of the use of alcohol. It must have been a very slow news cycle that year. The bottom line is that I and my friends are tired of the pompous politicians talking down to us (as you are doing in your postings) and we want to be able to believe in our country again. You can slice and dice the issues any way you want but until the politicians start proving to us that they deserve to represent us, we will vote them out of office. As pompous as you are and Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid and Barack Obama and a slew of other Democrats and Republicans are, it really doesn’t matter. They can’t hide behind their big words and 2000 page bills. We may have simple minds but true hearts. I know that is a tough concept for you and the other politicians to understand because you never felt the same way but again, it doesn’t matter. It only matters what this very, very big simple group of people believe about how we are being treated by our current politicians. If you think that our current politicians are properly representing our country and spending responsibly and have our best interests at heart and don’t take things from lobbyists that they shouldn’t and sell their vote to the highest bidder then, I’m afraid to say, yours is the simplest mind in the group and you should join us. I encourage my fellow citizens in this group to not be dismayed by your cleaver words. We’ve seen them before and they will continue and continue and get worse and worse as we move forward. What you and those who would try to confuse and separate us don’t understand is that we, in fact are simple and we hold these truths to be self evident that banana heads like you will never stand between us and our country and our right to a government that answers only to us. I do thank you for your comments and opinion as my participation would not be possible without them.
Have a wonderful day…
The difference between Socialism, Communism and Fascism? Maybe you should be the one educating yourself. Communism, Fascism and Nazism for that matter are all sects of socialism and an inevitable end to their socialist means. What’s Nazi stand for again, oh yeah, German Socialist Workers Party. How about U.S.S.R., Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. Fascism is still not well defined but If you need a definition to recognize it’s socialist heritage than you are truly blind. The only difference between Fascism and Socialism is that it replaces racism with nationalism. To put it simply ” don’t worry we’ll screw everybody over equally.” Just because these other groups don’t call themselves socialist doesn’t mean that they are not socialists. The Nazis just happened to be the only group here smart enough to recognize that they were preaching socialism.
I haven’t seen no dis harmony. The main issue is to remove 545 from congress and re institute constitutional values.
Somebody please help me understand the tea party movement. Any response is welcome. I’ll give you my opinion and you give me yours. I think the tea party will falter and fail because they’re not FOR anything, they’re only AGAINST anything that the President and Democrat party propose. But what do you propose to help America become a better country?
The Republicans had no budget to speak of, just a few pages of platitudes without a single number (budgets need numbers). The Republican health reform was evaluated poorly by the CBO and is not discussed any more.
Personally, I think the recession has many people hard, very hard, and they’re angry. I am too. My pay was cut by 20% which I saw as a bargain compared to the alternative. But anger is not a plan. Objection to everything the President supports is not a plan.
Tea partiers say they are against government spending, but where were they when Bush was running up the deficit, partly by cutting taxes for the rich (which, by the way, did nothing to improve the growth of jobs in this country).
Please don’t tell me you’re in favor of the “Constitution” or want to “get your country back.” Those don’t tell me anything.
Please, somebody, give me some concrete idea. What are tea partiers FOR? What legislation would you introduce, and what you you repeal? Or is it just anger? Or is it something else?
Try reading the Constitution so have a better idea of what we’re FOR. It’s the contract between the founding government and its citizens. The Constitution gives specific powers to Congress and nothing more. I suggest repealing everything that is unConstitutional, starting with the Progressive Income Tax, Social Security and Medicare.
We weren’t happy with Bush, we were just less vocal. This has been a growing dissatisfaction with the relationship between taxpayers and government. If you had such a problem with government spending then – why are you OK with it now? If you had a problem with the debt that Bush left behind, why are you OK with Obama quadrupling it? We’re not objecting because Obama supports something – we’re objecting because it’s the wrong direction for the Country to go in. We wouldn’t object if Obama decided to start shinking government and the control it has over its people.
Well spoken MerNJ. I appreciate your thoughtful response. But of course I disagree with you on several points!
I’m not okay with the incomprehensible government under this administration or the previous one. As a financially conservative person in my own life, it seems terribly irresponsible on the one hand. But on the other, I think if the all the major financial institutions had failed, as well as many of the largest employers, this country might have collapsed into something close to the Great Depression. Even Bush, against every instinct, agreed to a bailout of the banks. I’m not going to second guess that now, and can only hope it was the best thing.
I disagree with you completely about progressive income tax, Social Security and Medicare being unconstitutional for two reasons, one legal and one philosophical.
The progressive income tax, Social Security and Medicare have never been successfully challenged in court. According to the Supreme Court, those are constitutional programs. You claim those programs are unconstitutional, but you are wrong on that point.
I think you’re also blind on the idea that a flat tax is a fair system. You are the beneficiary of progressive income tax. Who do you think pays for the roads you drive, the schools your kids go to, your parks and your libraries? You pay some and so do I, but the richest pay the most. Unless you make a million a year, your are the beneficiary of progressive income tax. If you are true to your principals, you’ll give up a lot.
My other point would be that I think our country should be judged, and will judged in history, not by how we support our wealthiest people, but how we support our poorest.
Man, you people just don’t get it do you! This is not about policies or parties! This is not about being mad or disliking the president! This is about taking back control of our country like it was before! We the people…… in case you don’t remember! The house of Rejects are supposed to be representing us the people of the UNITED States. If we say we don’t want something then that means NO! Don’t back door us and force something down our throats. When they take the oath of office, they swear to uphold the laws and the CONSTITUTION. That does not in any way, shape or form mean to do what I want to do and work out back door deals to get there and who cares what the people want! Thats the problem with these liberally infected people! They are always lying and back door dealing and trying to change what isn’t even broken but they don’t want to even try to fix the failed problems that they already have created! Wake Up for Gods sake! This isn’t a fairy tale life in a make believe kingdom. This is reality and there are consequences.
What was the country like “before?” I hear that from many people arguing against changing policy. Are you talking about before there was women’s suffrage or when a black man’s vote was 3/5 of a white man? The American Constitution was designed to evolve beyond the ideas of the framers. “We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union…” It does not say perfect union; this was admittedly a work-in-progress. So when you want the country back to the way it was before, at least specify who’s rights you’d like to repeal because this country has evolved into a nation with civil rights for all of its citizens. That didn’t happen overnight.
I believe you may be misjudging the tea party movement and/or you have your own political agenda that you are “trying” to sell to the rest of us here. I have watched the “Movement” with great interest and totally understand where they are coming from. I have yet to see any of the “angry” mobs that you are hinting to and all I have seen for the most part, are large groups of people utilizing their 1st Amendment rights. The large majority are protesting the Government Heath Care “plan” and the lack of trust that the government could run it any better that the current system we have. Our current system is not perfect, but you tell me the last time the government has been able to run a major “social” program with any efficiency and under a “promised” budget? The Social Security Tax that we all pay into is a perfect example; A government program that started out with the best of intentions. How could you argue that, when the program first started, who wouldn’t want to help the widows and elderly of this great country! But look at the program now, the FICA taxes have increased at a greater rate than inflation, the Congress and Senate dipping into the Social Security “kitty” to finance other government programs or their own pet projects and a system that pays out to all, no matter how rich or poor (a program that originally paid out to those who couldn’t help themselves). So, how can anyone expect to “trust” the government on taking over health care. What amount of taxes are they going to add to our already heavy burden? How many jobs will be lost? What is fair compensation to a great doctor, a scientist that comes up with the cure for cancer or a pharmaceutical company that finds a cure for AIDS? Maybe, just maybe, those doctors, scientist and companies won’t have the money or incentive to accomplish some of those great task. Just look at the States or Countries that have attempted Universal Health Care, all have huge problems and/or are bankrupt. So if your question is what do the Tea Party protesters stand for. They stand for the following: They are trying to stand up against a political machine that is corrupt, unfair and just doesn’t listen to “We the People” anymore. They are tired of ever increasing taxes, the shady backroom deals amongst themselves and the lobbyist and the “transparency” that was promised to all of us. I imagine that a lot, including myself, wonder if our founding fathers felt this way when they rose up against the British. Is this how a revolution starts? Fortunately, we can all still use our vote as weapon and I think that that is the point they are trying to make, ignore us now and your going to pay later (2010 and 2012)! And really, what is wrong with a little healthy protesting here and there. Some of America’s greatest wrongs were righted via protest, i.e. women being able to vote, the Civil Rights movement, etc… And I believe this is what they are trying to accomplish, in my humble opinion.
Agreed poundcake. I have not seen or heard anything to suggest disharmony at tea parties. The goal is clear and the stakes too high.
good try!!!