A Card Check Update
Posted by the912project on March 23, 2009 · 204 Comments
Starbucks, Costco and Whole Foods team up on labor bill.
How do you feel about the issue of making the decision to join a union?
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204 Responses to “A Card Check Update”The Restoring Honor Rally August 28, 2010
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Carlos, go to http://www.govtrack.us/congress/
it is a wealth of information
Walker1333
Oh MAN, Stossel would be awesome! Guys if you are not familiar with Stossel he is someone who GETS IT. Check him out. (Doubt he would run, but a good example of the required mindset)
Yeah, lets not assume we need a "conservative." We need someone dedicated to freedom both economic and personal. Most modern conservatives are good on economic freedom, for the most part, but not that strong on personal freedom, except where it concerns the Republican base (guns, tobacco, religous expression, etc.).
Liberals…well who can be sure what they really believe anymore except that they want someone there to catch them if they fall. That's modern liberalism in a nutshell.
I agree with Ron Paul on most things. I'm a libertarian (little L denoting beliefs not big L denoting party). Not sure if he's electable, but we need someone with that love of real, true, pure freedom.
By the way, I suspect all of you are really libertarians, so prove me wrong: Take the World's Smallest Political Quiz: http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html
Maybe start with this page and go from there (the post…eeeew)
http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/
May I also recommend that if you are wondering if you are a libertarian at heart, take the World's Smallest Political Quiz. Takes but a minute and is enlightening. http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz.html
Pet rock "comradeobama" wrote
"I don't get what is so evil about this."
Because all things from the left are evil you hate mongering terorist sympathiser and a hater of America.
View Pet rock "comradeobama" in all his glory
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RuhAQbzSXo&NR...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_K5_orMQRY
It's very "politic" of them to offer a compromise, but it's a sign of weakness for the Obama Sharks, who don't usually "play by the rules".
UNION THUGS
Make no mistake about it “Card Check”
makes a worker subject to union thugs.
I have been personally threatened by
union organizers who indicated that
my wife could be the “random victim”
of a rape or that my car might just
explode someday.
“You don’t seem to understand who we are.”
They were just a little upset that I was not
hopping to, to their demands.
I had clearly explained that I had encountered
their kind before in Viet Nam.
Creatures that attached themselves to you and
sucked your blood but other than that were good
for nothing.
Calling this “The Free Choice Act”
will not cause the leopard to change its spots…
Semper Fi
Free Man
Houston, Republic of Texas
PS
Perhaps the government should establish a total
compensation cap of $50,000 for ALL labor union
employees if they are so concerned for the worker.
Unionizing Starbucks will be there corporate deathknell. Unionizing Costco will put them out of business, as they would not be able to maintain there competitive edge with Sam's Club ( Wal-Mart) .No way would they be able to keep there pricing in Check. Dunkin donuts and McDonald's already have taken big chunks of Starbucks business, this would take it over the top…. Who needs a $4.00 cup of coffee when there is no work?
I grew up in a very typical blue collar family….Union through and through….but my grand father told me years ago that Unions had lost their way….out lived their purpose and reason for being. I agreed then, and agree now. Most folks in unions are GREAT people, hard working people. But much of the leadership is far left, and not out to help the average person. They are more like the agents you see around sports, they suck the life out of companies and workers alike.
It is obvious to most conservatives and some Blue Dogs, that our country is under attack. This war, however, is directed at the very heart of Liberty and Freedom and the belief that we should remain a free society.
Do not be fooled by the "dog and pony" show of the left. What you now see happening is calculated, deliberate and well orchestrated. While our attention is on the smoke and mirrors, they write legislation that strips away our every freedom and right. Look at the House Bills and read not only the letter but the hidden agenda that the left is shoving down our collective throats. They truely believe that if they cut up that elephant (socialism) in small enough, yet many, pieces we will eat every bit of it…….and they're right! Just look at all the brain dead, do nothing, expect everything society they have already created! Mr Emanuel's puppet and his administration must be stopped! WAKE UP!!
I agree with all of the posts about how bad unions are for competitive industries. Just look at GM vs Toyota. GM's costs are out of line with non-union shops because of exhorbitant legacy costs. What I haven't read is the most insidious thing about unions – they take away your liberty. I for one would relish a fight with a union goon and I would never, never, never let them take my dues so they can campaign for liberals. It just would not happen to me. How sad that many union members have relinquished part of their salary to elect liberals in congress and they don't even have a say in the matter. Many union members are way more traditional and conservative than their union bosses and they should fight back and not allow them to use their dues to be the campaign arm of Obama, Pelosi and Reid.
With that said, what should we propose to do about stopping card check from becoming law. I am contacting my congressman and my senators to strongly oppose this legislation. What do you all recommend we do? Any suggestions?
I agree! Sarah Palin is absolutely _NOT_ stupid!
I would certainly be comfortable with her on the ticket. In fact, I was! She has some media attention now, and I believe a little more pull. I'm quite anxious to see how she'll use it. I see good things from her.
If New Hampshire doesn't get it's collective head out of the dark place, I may move to Alaska….
I think that this liberalism that is taking over our country is the same sickness that took over Germany with the
Nazi Party . Everyday things are get scarier and scarier.
Carlos M ,I keep reading your post. I think we should all join the Libertarian Party They are the 3rd largest
party. go to LP. org. and check them out, Look at there Preambles and there Statement of Principles
Mtnman , Hitler had his brown shirts and the Hitler youth now Obama will have his green shirts.
God help us all.
Nevada is aright to work state.
While we were watching today's crap, at 5:35 today the Congress PASSED A BILL GIVING PRES. OBAMA his on personel "ARMY, tomarrow it go's befofe the SENATE for a vote. 'THIS IS NOT A JOKE. THIS IS WHERE OUR FREEDOM IS GOING. I can't believe nobody on FOX news, or CNN. didn't catch this. We have to start watching what's going on besides what the theme of the day is. Its a smoke and screen job, and we better start looking to whats going on behind the scene's. It ain't pretty.
mtnman, I would like to read about this, is there any info on line regarding the army for Obama? Also has any other president had a personal army?
Well ,as for joining a union , here is how i see it ,
1. why would you fight for your rights and freedoms. then jion a union and lose your individuality. Just doesn't make "common sense"
2. do your work for your pay , no need to muscle a company into big contracts that they can't sustain, like having your healthcare and wages paid for from that company even after you retire , how do those wanting contracts like these think the companies can sustain that?
God bless all 912ers, stand together brothers and sisters we will suceed,
"liberty of death"
"hold the fort"
How about the house minority leader John Boehner?
BULL! There is no a scret ballot when the Union rep hands you a ballot and stands there while you sign it. Good possibility for them "to make an offer you can't refuse". If card check is so good, why are the unions pushing it so hard. Why do they need congress to pass a law. I'll save you from straining….because union membership is falling and the unions need the money. As I mentioned earlier…big 3 need bailouts, Auto makers in right to work states are doing ok. Why? No unions. Cars made in non union plants less expensive, and in some cases better made.
I rest my case
Does the screen name comrade obama tell you anything? I appreciate the knee-jerk reaction to respond, however, I think the poster (a DailyKos fan for sure) was simply looking for a reaction. That being said, thank you for the retort.
Maybe! But crap like that can't go unanswered. There maybe some young people out there that really do not understand some of these things. We NEED to answer any of the far left crap immediately! The left uses Hitler's idea “Tell a lie long enough and loud enough…It becomes the truth.” We learned that with Pres Bush, thanK God that Glenn has given us a chance to counter the crap, now if 912 people who blog can link and fight the left we may have a chance. We are fighting big money,the 3 proganda arms of the Obama regime (NBC,ABC,CBS) and of course the “mainstream” media(the Tass and Pravada of the U.S.)
What do you think will happen to the person who doesn't want to join the union? Do you think they will be able to continue working there if the union wins? The point of the secret ballot is to keep people from being coerced and yes, some union people, not all, but some, do use coercion. I've had enough family members in unions in NY to know how the system works and it stinks. I
we can start by shifting the burden where it should be, onto the private sector. a good starting point would be to get rid of the goverment security firm created for private business TSA. the employees would still be employed, only by the airlines. the standards have already been set, now we just need for private business to fund it and maintain those standards. once we have weened our selves from the government tit , let us never go back. we pick the next "government company" and send it into the private sector. for those of you who's knees are shaking at the thought of not having a multi billion dollar government security blanket, just pull the pillow over your head and think good thoughts. the rest of us will stand up to the scary monsters, as usual.
congress is a union. they tell us what their pay will be, and how much we can keep. they regulate ALL business. and take dues from us in the form of taxes. the time has come to quit the union and save the company (the country) no business can survive the type of spending we have done in the last sixty days, let alone four years. and no investor in their right mind will lend their capital knowing they will never be able to get it back. our government is broken, it got that way due to neglect on the part of the people, and abuse by the politicians. it is time to push the reset button and return to the original contract with america, the Constitution.
Prophet;
There were people in the very same factory I wrote of that worshiped the union, they actually believed the union protected their jobs. If they overheard a negative complaint about the union they’d; “say you’re lucky to have a job”. I couldn’t understand how they didn’t realize what was happening to them, how they were being used.
These very same people would have a fit when a rate would change. It just didn’t make sense!
For me it turned out to be a blessing in disguise because working there made me more determined than ever to go to college and improve my status.
9% of non union workers want to join a union.
Right to work states have lower rates of unionization (~4% I think).
Right to work states have lower rates of workplace injury.
Taken together the above make a persuading case for making right to work the law of the land in my opinion. If unions are such a good thing then let them compete for workers' allegiance. And let's remove their anti trust exception while we're at it. And here's a radical idea, if a business is unionized the union should be required to provide a fund (amount to be detirmined by the business) for the business to relocate if they decide not to accept the union's terms.
As for card check, call me stubborn but I'd quit first.
I've had enough experience with unions growing up in NYC that I agree with you…I'd rather quit than work in a union shop. Is there anyone in DC naive enough, or, who thinks we are stupid enough, to believe that doing away with the secret ballot will be good for workers? The only people who will profit will be the unions themselves. I live in NC where there aren't many unions, but I guess that will be changing…so I guess I will have to start being careful where I shop. If this bill passes I will refuse to buy any good or service that is from a union shop, and I will start shopping in places where the unions can't go, like Farmer's Markets.
I believe that bodies such as the AFL-CIO are themselves a corporation and represent a powerful special interst group in Washington. When you start to look at who they've supported with funding, and massively so, it's very appraent they are buying votes. what they are doing is no different than companies such as Ford or GM, in trying to protect market share, or even expanding it. Put the business that they do into perspective – they are not better than the "evil" oil companies.
To put it bluntly, I find EFCA abhorrent and have written repeatedly to one of it's co-sponsors, Senator Murray. She has told me that it has not been reintroduced in the 111th Congress, but I have yet to let this rest.
The sum total of legislation and the Administrations positions on nearly every aspect of their assault on all things Amercian really tick me off – but I stay engaged with my representatives. I'm as forceful and as clear as I can be with them. I recommend the same for all of you. There are an awful lot of sheep out there who never exercise that relationship. They work for me, and I let them know that.
You both are correct. With card check only the unions win. Business does not win, therefore, employees do not win in the long run. Some employees may see higher salaries with card check/union, however everyone's cost of living will increase, thereby negating the effect of any salary increase.
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/megavote/
You can track every vote by your local House Rep and both Senators by using this link. I get emails every 7-10 days showing how they vote from my state. It is very informative.
I agree with both of you allan and ootadabun. We need someone who has strong believe in their religion and act in accordance to their beliefs. We do not need someon to preach from the podium, but we need someone who can heal this country and bring the aethist in under the concept of the founding fathers. The founding fathers did not force religion on anyone and this country was formed under religious persecution from European countries. The founding fathers felt the government was to be formed to protect the rights that God granted us. We have to someone who is tolerable of all believes and does not cave to the pressure of a small group.
Currently, Congress and others are trying to weed out God in every form that represents government on any level. We need to heal the country and show the tolerance once again.
The OldMarine is correct. I have seen union stewards negotiate a single pay increase % that is applied to each employee, regardless of performance. Therefore, poor performers get an unearned pay increase at the top performers expense. Top performers quit and hire on with a new employer to get a pay raise. The old employer looses big time because customers will follow the good employees to their new company. The union is not in business to help the business win. Their objective is to increase and maximize the union dues revenue by getting as many union dues payers on the employers payroll. The union has business objectives just like the business. I have never heard a union steward ask a business or operations manager the question "What can we do to help you win, meet your objectives, etc.?". If anyone has heard a union steward ask this question, please let me know. And in the states with a pro union bias, all employees must join the union. One's only choice is to quit and join a non-union employer. Good bye choice.
Ron Paul is an anti-Semite and, as a Jew, I would not vote for him. He is also a fringe person – his positions are too "out there" for me to take him serious.
Alan; It does give me pause for concern that Christians aren’t seen as viable candidates, but when prominent Christian Conservative Leaders sit silent as a fellow Christian, Sarah Pallin is raked over the coals something is wrong very wrong. I was upset that McCain didn’t come to her aid but I was most upset w/ the Christian Leadership.
No I am not ashamed of our principles I don’t believe you are either. I believe there will be a Christian Conservative candidate perhaps it will be in the next presidential election? If so I think it may well be Sarah Pallin. Alan, I have to ask, do you wonder; with all that’s been happening if we may not be ushering in the “end times”? If that be the case then Come Lord come!
God Bless, oota-da-bun
Alan had to respond here to your last post could not comment below.
That’s exactly what I mean in the current climate, he's unelectable. You're right we are susceptible to outside forces in the world that will always be the case because we are human and imperfect.
From my own prospective as a Christian Conservative; I don’t consider myself religious but rather spiritual and I would venture to say if you ask Alan Keyes he might say the same thing. To me religious relates to religiosity and is specific to church dogma denoting a feeling of piety. I am not a pious person, any good that is in me is by the Grace of God through Jesus Christ my Savior.
Having said all that, do you think perhaps it isn’t simply the influences of the world but rather projecting our own beliefs and feelings to have this country return to God that makes us more susceptible? How often do we say;” if I were in charge I’d this or that….” would that not make us think someone like me might well be theocratic.
continued………..
Card check is a criminal scam that eliminates the full voting process and secret ballot. It circumvents the basic democratic procedure by making the petition for a union vote an automatic vote to unionize.
Look at the irreversable damage the UAW has done to the American auto industry or the devastation the teachers' unions have inflicted upon the public school systems where the United States can no longer compete against the better educated students of foreign countries.
If I were king (given the hypothetical power of rule by declaration, please bear with me) I would abolish unions as they currently operate and replace them with a regulated Guild system as they existed (and still exist in parts of Europe) during the Middle Ages. A guild sets proper wages for the work of their members, certifies the level of expertise of its members (Apprentice, Journeyman, Master, etc.) and takes responsibility of the failure of its members to produce as determined by contract. In essence, the guilds would be obligated to remove or demote members who fail to meet standards in the same way they would support the rights of its members.
I think unions have lost their usefulness. When the leaders get chunky benefits and the majority of members lose jobs because of riduculous demands then who do the unions help? Now a new tactic by the unions which are being paid back by the left for their support? Then again you have the employee who does half the work he should and can't be fired because the unions are behind the inept as well as the hard worker. PLEASE
As Rich so eloquently cites, work conditions in this country have been miserable in the past. Now, however, there are far too many goverment regulatory orginisations at work on every level that insure workers enjoy safe work places, fair wages, and other workplace controls. By the way, we pay for those orginisations with our tax dollars…
So the only effect the unions have on our economy is to raise our domestic product prices, forcing Americans to purchase goods made elsewhere for less, reducing our manufacturing capacity, lowering our gross domestic product, running our greatest US companies into the ground, and in the end forcing our country into a ghost of it's former greatness… Let's make it even easier for them to ruin every company in the USA, sure….
I agree. In my opinion we have three outdated "issues" to address. Unions, school busing and equal employment opportunity. School busing and equal employment opportunity were moral legislations designed to enforce a moral ideal that would have come about naturally. Unions were morally correct in their time, however, there time has come and gone. As a consumer, I do not want to be subjected to the price increases that card-check will be responsible for. As an employee, I have no desire to be part of any union.
Amen Rich! As a former General Motors dealership employee in a right to work state, I ran up against issues in supply chain and disruptions to our business on a regular basis caused by the unions, both Teamsters and UAW. While some real quality people are employed in union facilities, those same people could get very good pay and benefits with a good company somewhere else. As a manager left responsible for errors up the supply chain, I developed a very low opinion of the "everyday" sort of worker employeed by unions.
Union bigwigs like Gettlefinger will do their darndest to convince anyone who will listen that the unions are essential to the automakers success and continued profit. What they neglect to mention is that the only parties benefiting these days are those same bigwigs (and the politicians with their hands in union pockets). Former union recruiters disillusioned with their jobs will tell you that they are nothing but huge money-generating machines and have the interests of their members in mind NOT AT ALL!
That's because we have fallen for the media label of Paul as a right fringe cook.. He is someone to consider and someone who is making a lot of sense these days.
I agree completely, OldMarine. The electoral college was geniusly put in place to give a voice to the little states and rural America. Without the electoral college, only the most populace cities and states are needed to win an election and that is demonstrably and overwhelmingly liberally bent towards the socialist mindset.
I don’t wear my Christianity as a “great label” nor do I need to re-read the 9 principles I LIVE them! I certainly will NOT leave this forum because you don’t like or understand what I wrote. It is a holier than thou attitude such as yours that turns the unsaved from Christianity.
look you can bet every time the union is for something it is bad for the consumer it puts a bloated price on everything
If card check is such a great idea, why don't we do away with secret ballots in all our political races? Why don't they elect the Speaker of the House by a card check system? What's next – "chain balloting" as they did in Chicagoin with paper ballots?
It is un-american!
This whole issue is of course just another trial balloon. If they can succeed in taking away the right to vote by secret ballot here then they can go after their real goal. Taking away the secret ballot when voting for congress. Anything that empowers individuals is a target for this administration.
I certainly wish we could get a strong third part going.
Hey, I don't disagree. Frankly as it stands now, she is our best hope.
The reason for the electoral college is to prevent populus states, say NY, TX, CA fom controling the election. There are more people in those 3 states then alot of what the elites call fly over states. I can think of no better way then the e college to keep elections on an even playing field. Frankly, I trust our founding fathers on this one. They gave us the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution, 2 for 2 is pretty good odds for me
With card check….hello union.
Card check aka Workers Free choice act, is the unions doing away with the secret ballot. Example: The union wants to unionize a business, as it stands the workers vote in secret. The votes are counted and the majority wins. Card Check, a union rep comes up to you hands you a card and asks you to sign to have the union represent you. Or they could do what they did in PA, hands you a card for a chance to win a Harley, at the bottom it states that you are in favor of a union. Next thing you know you're working in a union shop.
Another couple of opinions on unions: I feel that unless unions become competitive in their representation of workers, they are essentially a monopoly. Workers should have a choice of with which union they might affiliate and they should work hard to impress and represent and then maintain their membership. To many union workers in any industry get represented by one group and then the unions just want to increase their memberships and don't really give a doggone about what is happening in a certain shop or industry. And way too many unions are involved in or closely affiliated with organized crime.
Last, I think that unions should not be allowed to collect or donate money to PACs. Only individuals outside of a workplace should ever solicit for or be solicited for funds. If a person wants to contribute to an candidate, they should be doing it on their own, without prompting. And since union PAC and campaign support generally favor the DEMS and liberal candidates, and person who is a conservative will fall into great disfavor with the union if their voting record is ever found out. This pressure is far too great. No workplace should ever be a place where campaigning is done— just like churches should not be.